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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:22 pm 
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Car Models: 1972 99L 2 door
I have an arch repair panel to weld on to my 99 2 door body and in preparation for that i got the sander out to get some bare metal.

Unfortunately I didn't hit bare metal for quite some time as completely unknown to me, the entire panel behind the drivers door was covered in filler averaging 5mm in depth. :wall:

To be fair, it was a very very good job as it looked flat and smooth with paint on and in hindsight, the only giveaway was that the door shut never quite lined up properly due to the thickness of the filler.

Anyone, it needs fixing before i weld the repair panel in as it currently has ripples and undulations and isn't really a reliable datum for fixing new metal to.

I'd thought that mobile dent repair businesses would be able to deal with or at least improve the panel but having tried a number now, none of them seem interested. They either don't bother replying, do reply but say 'not our sort of work' and I've yet to get anyone to show any interest.

What do you think my options are?

I can't tell whether a piece of flat sheet could be let in effectively or not, the panel on the other side looks like it doesn't have any shape to it until it meets the arch or door shut going front and back or, the swage line going upwards. That swage line would be a decent point to make a join...

If anyone has a spare scrap shell they are currently cutting up, i would be interested in seeing photos of that area - if good, maybe it would be best to weld in as much factory steel as possible.

With the other repairs i'm doing at the moment; I'm learning fast welding the thin stuff and I can imagine that area would need to be welded up nice and slowly to minimise any heat distortion. The thought of that puts me off but not as much as unpicking spot welds and putting a whole panel in! :lol:


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:01 am 
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I would be loathe to cut and weld unnecessarily on that panel. The risk of distortion etc to get you to not a great deal better position (and maybe worse) is not worth it IMO.

A little filler is fine and any repair will need some unless you have some seriously good panel beating skills

Do your best to get to the right shape by using suction cups or nails welded on and a slide hammer. I improvised something like this on my white c900.

https://www.uksaabs.co.uk/UKS/viewtopic ... 35&t=50677

I'm not sure how well you can access the panel from behind and use the dent panel tools (no experience with these) or there are some proper pins you can buy something like this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/86pcs-Dent-P ... SwzYJfBEgj
Not sure how the "welder" works

Roughen the surface when you have got it almost right and epoxy primer (I lead tinned my Saab but probably wouldn't bother now) then filler. Use a template cut to match the other side for guidance and a long sanding block to shape. Where you go through the filler to the metal then epoxy prime again. Lechler 29107 (and associated hardener) is available from various places e.g. Express Paints but get it tinted as the natural colour is a sort of translucent grey.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:17 am 
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Hi Anjum, thanks for the reply and links. I'm kind of with you on not wanting to weld a patch in. I'm not looking forward to doing the arch repair panel for reasons of distortion so maybe I should know my limits and play safe! :lol:

The dent removal people all talk about the metal being stretched and that's a problem for them, that sounds like shrinking it would help so found such a thing as a 'shrinking hammer' exists. May give this a go...

Like you suggestion of templates off the other side. I've seen edge finders in the carpentry world, the longest one of these I can find will help check progress.

This sort of thing:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/5-10-Shape-C ... 890.l49292

I've got epoxy primer already in for the underside so ready to go when I get to that bit.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:55 pm 
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Don't need any fingers etc just cut some cardboard/ plywood etc templates maybe at different lines and use those.

The long sanding board is more important I've got one of these adapted with a bit of plywood and velcro to fit standard sanding pads.

Heat and cold might be a better way of shrinking the metal but make sure there is nothing behind the sheet metal.
The crease is going to be difficult to remove without wrecking the panel.

I think you may be in danger of over thinking this (don't ask me how I know :oops: ) if you accept that there will be a little filler then that's a relatively easy repair. The problem comes when you want to make it metal millimetre perfect like a delorean.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:03 pm 
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Hah, I've got no problem with filler! It was a perfectly decent job before I sanded it off. I just want to be able to put less back.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:22 am 
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Don't waste your money on a "shrinking hammer". They are totally useles.
As the PDR guys said, that area is pretty well stretched, and you run the risk of making it worse if you attempt to beat it out. If it's not "oil canning" then re fill as before. If it is "oil canning" after welding in your arch repair panel, planish what you can, then heat & quench to tighten the metal, then fill & paint.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2021 11:03 am 
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OK, shrinking hammer is a no then, I'm alright with that as well as they seem to cost a fair bit and don't come with inbuilt skill.

I have now found a dent guy who at least wants to come and look at the car so, what is saved on tools for me can be given to dent man who does come with inbuilt skill.

Hopefully all will be good...

Watch this space, cheers! :D


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:52 pm 
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:corn: :corn: :corn: :D

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:10 am 
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Well, finally after much delay, i managed to get a dent guy to come and look at the panel. He bought a selection of dollies, hammers and 25 years experience and... Failed.

He did achieve some straightening but the main issue is a high area bulging out that i wanted to reduce. It is this area which would need a large amount of filler around it to bring it all level.

Shrinking is clearly the only option as he got quite a deep 'oil can' pop inwards that shows there is stretching that needs reversing.

Im not sure how i feel about one idea he had - popping the 'oil can' in would actually sort the issue and lead to a surface that could eaisly be skimmed over but it would be 12-15mm deep at the most and if it ever popped out again, it would with enough force to launch the filler off!

Time to hit youtube and learn about shrinking!


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:26 pm 
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They had a similar problem on one of those American TV shows a little which ago, a large typical 'classic' yank pickup which looked OK but when the went to sort and prep it for paint they found had deep filler and 'stretched' scores along the body. The only way they could cure it without a lot of filling again was to remove the panels and hand shrink them with an English wheel and other old type tools, a lot of work! Good luck!

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 9:54 am 
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I am hoping to have a result by the end of march as i really want to be able to drive the car this summer.

Ive started the arch repair on that side now and cutting off the bottom 6 inches seems to have releived some of the stretching, well, that's my theory as the 'oil canning' has reduced quite a bit.

Photos when its done 8)


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2021 5:24 am 
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Well, the end of march is here and as hoped for in my post on 3rd March - here is the result to share and how after your help; I went about it. :D

The dent guy was of some benefit but with my mind set on re filling rather than welding in fresh panel, I found an area that was still a little high and would have required the rest of the panel to be brought up to meet it. A bit of tapping with a hammer in that area took it down below the surrounding metal and it was then time to start putting it all right.

I used HB Body 989 epoxy primer on the bare metal before putting any filler on. This was to seal what would be under the filler and it actually also helped showed up the true extend of damage.

The filler was Dinitrol 6030 Alusoft filler. I like this stuff quite a lot as it sands out to a fine feather edge very easily and the selling point on the website for me was that due to being filled with Aluminium powder rather than talcum powder; it was A. water proof and B. suitable for thicker applications without shrinking or cracking.

Many many layers were built up and once the scrape was filled, the filler was then applied on the whole panel to blend and correct the curve to match the door curve. I think I applied in the region of 15 different mixes of the filler chasing low spots which showed up after a quick rough block sand between layers.

Final block sand with a variety of rigid, flexible and different sized blocks was with 120grit / 240grit / 320grit and then epoxy primer back over the top to seal it all up and key into the few small rub throughs to bare metal. The HB Body 989 primer also gives a decent amount of build so with care in the final block sands before paint - there should be enough coating for me to not rub through again...

I am pretty happy with the result.

As well as the scrape disappearing, there is a 15cm square repair patch welded in at the bottom of the arch and 30cm of an arch repair panel also welded in on this side.

Bring on the colour! :D

Thanks all for your help.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2021 5:24 am 
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I cant add more than 3 pics per post for some reason so here is the final result to go with my previous post. :D

In case you are wondering that those 2 blobs in the panel are down at the bottom of the arch - they are M6 stainless steel Nutserts. My early 99 and I don't know but also maybe later ones as well have a small rubber stone chip guard over the wheel arch, great idea but it is held on with self tapping screws which is not such a great idea. The rear mudflaps are the same and its no coincidence that on both sides of the car i have had to put fresh steel in where self tapping screws were used. :(

M6 Nutserts now allow me to use a stainless steel threaded fastener without fear of damaging the integrity of my paint and giving rust a starter for 10 unseen under the rubber until it is too late.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 30, 2021 11:06 pm 
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:D Nice work. :D :D

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 9:49 am 
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That looks like a very good result, Steve. Well done!
I, too, would have wanted to get the metal as close as possible to the original shape to minimise the amount of filler.
Next time I need filler I'll go looking for the Dinitrol stuff.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:23 am 
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Thanks both! I'm pleased with it and more than happy to post up in case it may help someone with some aspect of their own projects, ive learnt so much myself from reading reading and reading. :geek:


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 6:24 pm 
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That's a very good result. Well done. I used the HB primer when I refurbished my brake calipers. I brushed it on but was surprised it dried shiny, not matt. Did you find the same when spraying?

I had been thinking about the same rust issues with the mud flaps etc on our c900 restoration - had to replace the rusty metal in our wheel arches too where it had rotted due to the fixings. I was thinking of rivets but Nutserts (which I hadn't heard of) sound worth looking into. Same principle but bigger, I guess.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 8:37 pm 
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Thankyou. :D

I found the HB primer has a slight sheen when sprayed but it does dull down as it cures. It takes a few days to a week to fully cure and go hard and after that, using the sanding blocks knocks the shine off no problem and i found it quick and no problem to sand at all. Some people report struggling to sand epoxy, i wonder if that's due to not being fully cured _if you don't wait it does clog your paper quickly.

The rivnuts do need a tool to fit them but ive never had a problem buying new tools so got one of these off ebay:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Professional ... 890.l49286

It was £24 when i got it in december so shop around! If i was buying it again, id probably get one without the assorted rivnuts as they are mild steel and as i wanted stainless - had to buy those seperately.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Metric-A2-St ... 890.l49286

I also put rivnuts in the bracket which holds the rubber flap in front of the rear wheel. Total of 20 used at the back and will probably treat the front the same way.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 9:14 pm 
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Thanks for those links, Steve. Worth buying the tool when there are a few to do I reckon.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 31, 2021 11:36 pm 
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ame2 wrote:
I had been thinking about the same rust issues with the mud flaps etc on our c900 restoration - had to replace the rusty metal in our wheel arches too where it had rotted due to the fixings. I was thinking of rivets but Nutserts (which I hadn't heard of) sound worth looking into. Same principle but bigger, I guess.

On the 9000, the rear mudflaps and trim are secured to the wheel-arches partly by using screws into plastic inserts, much like the Rivnuts. Being plastic, they won't create any sort of electrolytic reaction with the steel bodywork. On the other hand, while I would love to say how effective they are at preventing rust, the same holes seem to be a favourite starting point for rust on the 9000, like many other holes underneath the car. On my CSE, once I had replaced all the rusty metal at the rear of the car, I omitted those holes with the intention of bonding studs to the bodywork to use instead of screws. I still haven't done anything with them but the trim is held in place at other points so doesn't seem to mind not being fixed there too.

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