UKSaabs

THE site for UK Saab people!
It is currently Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:43 am

All times are UTC



Forum rules


The place for you to start a thread about and show us your car.

(Please stick to one thread, rather than starting several threads for the same vehicle).

Your Cars is the place for telling us about your new cars, minor upgrades and mini projects.
Full on restorations & major rebuilds should be posted in Restorations & Major Projects.



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:12 am 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
My problem is that the sticker is missing from the n/s rear door face panel. The V5 just says "blue". There were a number of blue shades available for the 9000 in 1997 so I want to be sure. Billj has been in touch with Orio to see if they can trace it from their VIN records but no joy. I feel sure it is Midnight Blue (257) and dove grey L35 but I need to know for sure. A 1997 sales brochure might help so I may get hold of one from ebay. The sticker is available from Orio (at £68) but you have to give them the trim codes so a fat lot of help.
I am a bit confused re. the underbody colour. Inside the rear wheelarch it is finished in body colour. Is that on top of any underseal or was it never applied there? I can't tell on the main underfloor area just what the finish colour was, it all looks black. Was the original finish black underseal? I cannot imagine that it was body colour. Inside the boot, under the load tray, and under the rear seats the colour is a light willow green. I assume this is what is applied to the complete bodyshell from an electrostatic dip at the factory. The top coat is then applied later and the inside does not get the treatment, hence the colour change. The photo of the rivet in my Workshop post on "exhaust heat shield " is in the underseat area and clearly shows the different colour.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:04 pm 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
I got my door open, it is definitely Midnight Blue - CC 257 with a clear coat lacquer according to the EPC, not sure what colour the floor is though.

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 1:39 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
Just about finished probing around the rear of the car. Nothing further turned up other than a small patch of rust right behind where the brake pipes kick up from the floor pan. Unfortunately it is not just a spot weld seam where the flat floor pan meets the riser under the rear seat, inside the car there is a strengthening channel beam supporting the rear seat. It is a very small area and I am not going to disturb it. I will clean up as best I can and prep the surfaces inside and out. Removed the brake lines from the connector under the front bulkhead. To my surprise they came away easily and the connectors look " as new ". The pipes themselves are in good shape apart from some small areas of surface rust so instead of replacing them I will clean them up and insert a new section right at the end where it joins the caliper. I had to cut them there because the ferrules were rusted. Whilst working at the front of the car on the pipe joiners I had a good look at the front jacking points. The o/s one is mangled and doesn't look in good shape. I think the floor pan is ok in that area but wont know untill I get the seats and carpets out and that is a long way off. The n/s point is ok.
So, the areas I have identified requiring welding are;
Rear n/s wheel arch-Went into small hole in one area so not a big job. Integrity of arch seems ok.
Rear o/s wheel arch-Gone in rear 1/3 so will need cutting out. Front 2/3 no rust at all.
Rear n/s inner wing. Old repair is unsightly and will be replaced.
Rear o/s inner wing. Ditto
Rear o/s inner wheel arch. Replace bottom few inches from nr. spring support round to rear wing
Rear n/s inner wheel arch. Small area near spring support. Minor work
Rear o/s inner wheel arch front. Hole giving access to interior rear door slam. Need patch.
Lip around filler pipe
N/s under boot floor channel few inches to rear of torsion bar bracket. Enthusiastic use of needle gun punched a hole.
That's about it. Probably all recognisable to 9000 users. The rest are patches of varying severity which I will treat with BH products. Waiting for my bodyshop man to drop by and give me his verdict. A lot of the stuff I have uncovered was not obvious from a first inspection.
Not seen anything yet to cause alarm. basically in sound condition but it does make me wonder if I paid this sort of attention to my "best" Aero , what I would find. I was costantly surprised by discovering rust under what appeared to be absolutely sound undercoat/ seam sealer. Basically anywhere there was a spot weld there was a good possibility to find a rust site, and where a hole had been drilled to take a pipe clip.
I have not yet seen a 9000 inside boot floor without a circle of rust around those blue pipe clips.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 3:54 pm 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
I'm hoping mine is not as long a list as this but the odds are not good judging by my windscreen surround.

I posted a thread on the Bodywork forum about Saab paint, they are all lacquered apparently, even non-metallic paints are matt finish and have a clear coat on top.

Cheers
Mike

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 4:36 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
masonmjs wrote:
I'm hoping mine is not as long a list as this

I think in 9000 terms it may be classed as a short list of not too great significance-at least that is what I am telling myself. At the back of my mind is always the thought I could have just left everything well alone and driven it at minimal cost-it had a long mot- but then, where's the fun in that?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:28 am 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
Yes I think your'e right enough there, I should probably be expecting the worst after 10 years just sitting idle. Must admit, I also enjoy the refurbishing process itself as much as the end result, something to do in my retirement.

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 3:13 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
Slow but steady progress-just an hour or so here and there. I have dealt with the rust patches at the rear except for in and around the wheelarches. Some welding is required there so the plan is to complete the central underfloor section at the rear so I can refit the suspension and fuel tank and have the car driveable to go to the bodyshop for welding and rear end respray.
Photos 1&2 show the underfloor with the rust "spots" attended to. 2 coats of Hydrate 80 followed by 2 coats of Electrox and a coat of BH epoxy mastic-brush on. The whole of the underfloor was then given a coat of mastic so the "spots" have had 2 coats. Photo 3. Photo 4 is the n/s spring pan after shotblasting. Just goes to show how it will search out any weak spot. I had no idea when I took them in. Luckily I have sourced a replacement[url]ImageImageImageImage[/url]
The suspension items are coming along. Any item with a bush has been blasted and epoxy primed followed by 2 coats electrox and 2 coats mastic, other items springs/brakes/ stoneguard etc are powder coated. The remaining items are away for galvanising.
Before anything goes back the next job is to clean up the brake lines and splice in a new section at the brake ends. I also have to fit a new fuel line from the filter to the rail.
I started this thread by commenting I was "only" spending money on consumeables for the moment. Well, it probably will not surprise many of you that the " only" money I have spent is £400!! Costs for any spares and pro services will be something else.
I have been keeping a careful check since I started and a few pounds here and there on consumeables soon adds up.
£213 BH products,
£81 Special tools (windscreen remover/big riveter/ special circlip pliers etc)
£75 Tool consumeables ( Drills/wire wheels/polycarb wheels/sanding belts etc)
£22 Sundries (Latex gloves/ paint mixing cups/ brushes etc )
I suppose I can't put it all to this project but the fact is I would not have spent any of it if I did not have the car.
I suppose i am enjoying it, lying on your back under the car brush applying underseal is mucky. Whatever, I press on.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 7:58 am 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
Nice work there Razani67, its going to be very comforting knowing your underbody is in such good condition, and it should last a long time with the trouble you are going to to get it that way.

I just have one question - what's holding the car up ?? :shock:

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 9:33 am 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
Thanks Mike. However you are the guy I am in awe of. working outside in Winter, at least I have the luxury of a garage, and going straight into welding!!!
The car is supported on timber across the wheels. The cill covers are off. I needed to clean up the rear jacking points hence the need to support a bit further forward.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 12:01 pm 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
I haven't really started in earnest yet, so I have all of what you are doing to look forward to .... and the weather is stopping me most days really, I only get out and do something when it's not raining. I have been erecting a S/H shed in my back garden for there last week, at least I will have somewhere other than the back of the kitchen to clean up parts I remove (much to my wife's relief for sure). So far I have been concentrating on the windscreen and the bits I took off the front (spoiler, bumper, headlights etc), they are all now mostly cleaned up and repaired ready to go back on once I get the coolant system flushed and re-filled, and the brake pipes renewed (see below).

I noticed I had some liquid leaking when I had the car on axle stands and had a look under, it's coming from the brake pipes that run from front to rear and have been leaking for some time I think as when we drove it onto the car trailer for shipping back from France I noticed that brakes and clutch were both dodgy (working at the end of the pedal travel). When I got back from my 3 month 'busman's holiday' I noticed that the clutch and brake fluid reservoir was quite low (below, or very nearly below the minimum fluid level), the leak under the car now explains that I think.

By the way, I was wondering how you got on with removing your cill covers and various other parts of the plastic trim on the car. Mine were all fairly rusty and I had to angle grind some of the captive nuts (actually jack-nuts) off the panels. Let me know if you are having similar problems as I managed to find quite a few good places for this type of thing and have now replaced all of my panel fasteners with new ones, (some stainless steel). I am actually looking forward to fitting all of those panels as they should be a doddle compared with removing them.

The welding .... well I can only say that I managed to get the new bits in and joined sufficiently well to keep it together, I'm not sure a proper welder would call it welding but it is a hard place to start for sure, the panel in front of the screen curves in 2 directions and has a rounded section to boot, it's a nightmare. I think if I had the time again I would be searching for a good shell somewhere (yeah right !!) and would cut out the bits I wanted from it for welding onto mine. Realistically making the repair patches is the hardest part, I think it is better to spot weld the new bits in and fill in the gaps after that (unless you are a competent welder of course).

Anyway, good luck, it will be nice to see all of these 9000's at a meet somewhere in the future.

Cheers
Mike

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Nov 23, 2019 12:34 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
masonmjs wrote:
By the way, I was wondering how you got on with removing your cill covers and various other parts of the plastic trim on the car.

Most of the cill bolts go into plastic nuts so they remove ok. The devils tend to be those in the wheel arches that go into dreaded jacknuts. Here i resort to grinding off the bolt heads with a mini air belt grinder. I grind away for a few moments than squirt water on the bolt from a plasic spray bottle to cool it down. If you don't do this the heat will soften the plastic too much. Same with the jacknuts securing the front undershield. Worst of all are those little ones holding the spoiler to the bumper. The heads are recessed so can't get my grinder in. Thats a drilling job. Replacement jacknuts are readily available but not found any stainless. Then use stainless replacement bolts.
Dealing with brake lines is easy enough if you have the right tools. Just be aware of the pitfalls re matching fittings.I have posted some threads on this.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2019 6:51 am 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
razani67 wrote:
masonmjs wrote:
By the way, I was wondering how you got on with removing your cill covers and various other parts of the plastic trim on the car.

Most of the cill bolts go into plastic nuts so they remove ok. The devils tend to be those in the wheel arches that go into dreaded jacknuts. Here i resort to grinding off the bolt heads with a mini air belt grinder. I grind away for a few moments than squirt water on the bolt from a plasic spray bottle to cool it down. If you don't do this the heat will soften the plastic too much. Same with the jacknuts securing the front undershield. Worst of all are those little ones holding the spoiler to the bumper. The heads are recessed so can't get my grinder in. Thats a drilling job. Replacement jacknuts are readily available but not found any stainless. Then use stainless replacement bolts.
Dealing with brake lines is easy enough if you have the right tools. Just be aware of the pitfalls re matching fittings.I have posted some threads on this.


I honestly can't remember how I got the spoiler off as I know that the jack nuts are part of the bumper assembly, I replaced mine and will be using M4 SS bolts to put it back together, it is a complete pig of a job though, which is the reason I went to town on mine whilst I had it all off the car.

I bought a brake pipe flaring tool for the 9-5 brake lines when I replaced the front calipers, hopefully they will be the same for the 9000 ??

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 6:42 pm 
Offline
Full Pressure Turbo
User avatar

Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:05 pm
Posts: 949
Location: Crewe, Cheshire
Car Model: 2002 Saab 9-5 Aero Estate
Any sign of the bits back from the galvanising process yet ?? I'm curious to see how they turn out, the prices seem pretty cheap on the whole so depending on your impressions when your suspension parts return I may consider it ...

_________________
'02' 9-5 Aero wagon
'98' 9-5 SE 2.3LPT
'98' 9000 CSE 2.0LPT
'01' 9-5 2.0L LPT
'97' Merc SL500 (oops)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:40 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
masonmjs wrote:
Any sign of the bits back from the galvanising process yet ??

I pick them up at the end of the week. I'll post then with some photos


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:28 am 
Offline
Saab Nut
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 9:51 pm
Posts: 1001
Location: Edinburgh
Car Model: 9-5 2.3t Arc Estate
razani67 wrote:
2 coats of Hydrate 80 followed by 2 coats of Electrox and a coat of BH epoxy mastic-brush on. The whole of the underfloor was then given a coat of mastic so the "spots" have had 2 coats.


Nice to see the good work you are doing here and it reminds me that I must get onto my 9000 after I get the 9-5 saloon back together and sort the rear handbrake and brake shields on the wagon.

You are going through a very similar process to me apart from one thing. I am also using Hydrate 80 and Electrox but as I understand it for them to be effective both have to be in contact with bare metal. I am therefore only using the Hydrate 80 on previously corroded areas and I am using the Electrox on my patch panels as a weld through primer and cleaned areas that haven't suffered historic corrosion. As I understand it using the Electrox over Hydrate 80 means that it won't offer any additional protection because it cannot act in the manner it is designed to which is similar to galvanising. You are therefore just using it as an expensive primer.

I must admit I sprayed it over some of my H80 areas ut only where it was adjacent to clean steel.

You could save yourself some money by using a good quality primer or the areas treated with H80.

I have copied this link where I found my advice. https://bilt-hamber.freshdesk.com/suppo ... ydrate-80-

Keep up the good work though, this will be good reference for my future project.

_________________
Saab 9-5 2.3t Arc auto estate (Big Red)
Saab 9000 2.3 CDi S auto
Saab 9-5 2.0t Airflow
Jaguar XJ6


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:33 am 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
Ah!!!. I suspected that may be the case. Thanks for posting a definitive answer. So,as you say, I am just using it as an expensive primer. Some of the suspensiom items i have had shotblasted have therefore been blasted/epoxy zinc rich primed/ 2 coats brush Eletrox/2 coats brush epoxy mastic. Can't do any harm but may be gilding the lily. I bought a 1L tin of Electrox which will probably do everything I want to do on the car so will continue using it up and then rethink what to put on the Hydrate 80 should I ever finish the tin.
Edit; I suppose this does beg the question as to what to put on as the primary coat. If there is any hint of rust left in the pits I would go for Hydrate 80 over Electrox. In fact I would probably only use Electrox on clean metal that had been blasted less than 24hrs beforehand.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 4:39 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
Just spent an hour or so under the car. Removed the fuel line from filter to rail in preparation for fitting a replacement. Since I have the 2 long brake lines out ready for cleaning and splicing a new piece in, I thought I would clean up around the mini tunnel where all the pipes sit held by those white 4 pipe clips. A number of them had corrosion underneath and one in particular is a bit crusty. Unfortunately I really need to drive the plastic rivets down to recover the clips and the rivet. That means removing the seats and carpet and I dont have room for all this additional dismantling. I will drive the rivets up into the cabin and recover them at a later stage and in the meantime just fit a clip at each end of the line which will allow me to get the car mobile. Whilst under I had a close look at the o/s front jacking point. It has been properly mullered by improper use of a jack ( fairly common) but there is a lot of rust around the floor pan in the area that needs checking out. In the meantime I have opened out the jaws so It will take the oem jack once more.
I suspect that Saab drilled holes for the plasic rivets subsequent to treatment of the shells so there is no protection and you need to watch out everywhere one is fitted
Edit; Well, that went better than expected. Drove the rivets upwards from under the car, pulled down the clips-AND-the carpet had pushed the rivet back through the hole so I was able to recover it. Of the 6 pipe clips only one of the rivets failed to emege and is lying up there somewhere under the carpet
Having removed the clips had a close look at the holes. 3 or 4 of the clips showed no sign of rust around them, even with the clip removed the underseal seemed unbroken but a bit of poking around the perimeter of the hole soon revealed otherwise. ALL the holes have a corona of rust, either visible or under the underseal. A bit of work with the wire wheel and all ok. I have no doubt I will find rust around the hole inside the cabin but that will have to wait. Anyone doing a similar job just be aware, Those plastic rivets are a menace and you don't spot anything from a casual glance.


Last edited by razani67 on Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2019 12:59 pm 
Offline
Saab Nut

Joined: Tue Sep 14, 2010 9:11 am
Posts: 1362
Have the stuff back from the galvanisers. Not quite what i expected. I was thinking in terms of a smooth "snowflake" type grey finish. Well it isn't. It's bright with blobs and surface imperfections everywhere. It is an industrial finish, and no doubt from a corrosion point of view will outlast the car, but cosmetically leaves much to be desired. Does it matter?-probably not. It will have a bit of a bling effect under the car so I may resort to etch primer and mastic just for cosmetic reasons but I will install them first and see. A 10mm bolt enters the spring pan fine which seems to confirm the oem finish was galvanised.[url]Image[/url]
The price was £65 incl.vat. It was just 7kg. Their fixed price of 65 is for up to 20kg. Note you will need to shotblast first.
These are the items I have given the BH treatment. Shotblast and epoxy prime followed by 2 coats Electrox/2 coats epoxy mastic.They did not go for powder coating on account of the bushes. Missing from the photo are the hubs. They will be wire wheeled and hydrate 80. They wont go anywhere near shotblast, they would not be able to keep it out of the bearings.
[url]Image[/url]
These are the items I have had powder coated. Missing are the calipers and one of the springs still at the place.The trim strip at the front of the boot space has come out very well. It is their "leatherette" finish which nicely replicates the oem.
[url]Image[/url]
I guess i wont get around to mounting these items till the New Year. I need to sort the fuel & Brake l;ines first.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2019 1:36 pm 
Offline
UKS Addict

Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2011 11:34 pm
Posts: 2393
Car Model: 9000 Aero
Looking good - I quite like the bling finish 8)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2019 1:51 pm 
Offline
UKS Addict
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2007 4:12 pm
Posts: 8791
Location: Portsmouth
Car Model: 96 V4 & 9-3 Turbo-X
Bring on the bling.

Personally I'd have done all the suspension parts and fitted new bushes. Would have been like new.

It is possible to do powder coating over galvanising too if you want to hide it.

_________________
'75 96 V4 Anniversary Restoration Project
'09 9-3 Turbo-X Wagon No. 38
B204 Haynes Roadster Project


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group

follow UKSaabs on Twitter



UKSaabs silhouette logo images by Mark Green www.greenphotos.com
"subsilver2" slightly bodged by UKSaabs for our own use.

:: Disclaimer ::
Comments posted here are the views of their individual authors and are not necessarily shared by the owners of this Web site.
Authors assume all responsibility for comments posted here.

UKSaabs The biggest and best privately owned UK based independent Saab forum for all SAAB enthusiasts.
Whilst we encourage our users to support our advertisers the site wishes to remain independent and therefore does not endorse any particular advertiser(s)
UKSaabs is not affiliated with Saab Cars UK or Saab Automobile AB