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 Post subject: Saab 9-5 Aero - MOT fail
PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:13 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:09 am
Posts: 11
Car Model: VW
Sent the Saab in for it's MOT today and it failed, relatively spectacularly on the following items:

- Nearside Front Tyre has a tear, caused by separation or partial failure of its structure (4.1.D.1b)
- Offside Front Tyre tread depth below requirements of 1.6mm (4.1.E.1)
- Nearside Seat belt anchorage prescribed area is excessively corroded (5.2.6)
- Offside Seat belt anchorage prescribed area is excessively corroded (5.2.6)
- Nearside Front Sub-frame rubber bush deteriorated resulting in excessive movement (2.4.G.2)
- Offside Front Sub-frame rubber bush deteriorated resulting in excessive movement (2.4.G.2)
- Offside Front position lamp(s) not working (1.1.A.3b)

I knew it needed new front tyres but the other things aren't the best! Even though we have had 12k miles with no issues looks like our time together might be coming to an end. What do you think would be the best thing to do with it, will anyone buy it in it's current position or is the only way I am going to get some money out to break/scrap it? Do any of the specialists but MOT fails as parts cars?

Thank you in advance.

Cheers
Gareth


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:45 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:35 pm
Posts: 286
Location: Wrexham, N Wales
Car Model: Saab 9-5 Aero
Break it or repair it either way 9-5 aero don't go for much money at the moment (fingers crossed the value of 9-5 start increasing soon)

Wish you look with whatever choice you make

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Saab 9-5 Aero, Noobtune Stage One Remap, Stainless Steel Cat Back Exhaust System, Maptun Dump Valve


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:48 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:52 am
Posts: 22670
Location: not in a SAAB.
Car Model: One of the first RHD 9-5s
9-5s arent that well known for going rusty so its unlikely anybody would want it if its had to have significant welding done to it. All the other stuff is normal for any car though.

If you can strip it there are some valuable bits, particularly if you can pull the engine as a complete unit. If you sell it then it will end up being stripped anyway so dont expect too see too many £££s for it.

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97 9-5 2.0LPT Manual with B205R
97 9-5 2.0LPT Auto
52 9-5 2.0LPT Vector Sport


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:35 pm
Posts: 286
Location: Wrexham, N Wales
Car Model: Saab 9-5 Aero
Seen a few advertised as spare or repairs from corrosion around the seat belt anchor points...all estate models as well

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Saab 9-5 Aero, Noobtune Stage One Remap, Stainless Steel Cat Back Exhaust System, Maptun Dump Valve


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:08 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 8:13 pm
Posts: 981
Location: Peterborough UK
Car Model: 9-5 Aero 2001;9-5 Estate 1999
Rare for the seat belt anchor point to rust that badly.
I have had advisories and "next year it will fail" comments for surface rust on springs and shock absorbers,brake pipes etc Usually that stirs me into action with a wire brush and hammerite.
Sure you didnt get the MOT guy on a bad day?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:09 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2017 9:14 pm
Posts: 35
Car Model: saab 9-5
Bit miffed by this, the anchorage points are fixed to the front seats and the inertia reel is attached inside the middle door post, unless i am missing something, what year is your 9-5 ?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:15 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 8:13 pm
Posts: 981
Location: Peterborough UK
Car Model: 9-5 Aero 2001;9-5 Estate 1999
saab99t wrote:
Bit miffed by this, the anchorage points are fixed to the front seats and the inertia reel is attached inside the middle door post, unless i am missing something, what year is your 9-5 ?


Must refer to the rears...even so there are retaining nuts (I think) spot welded to the floor pan underneath.Logic would suggest the floor pan must be rusted through around those points...thats a hefty chunk of metal obscured by the fuel tank to be judged badly corroded?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:26 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:09 am
Posts: 11
Car Model: VW
It's a 2002 model, I have taken other car's to the same MOT centre and he has always been fair with things, he passed the last car with no advisories although I had spent money and time fitting new brakes, handbrakes, suspension components etc. I know breaking it will get the most money back but just not sure I have the time or inclination, might stick it on eBay at 99p start and see what happens


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:37 pm 
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Full Pressure Turbo
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Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:42 pm
Posts: 692
Location: Devon
Car Model: 2005 9-5 2.3T Vector
cjapeterborough wrote:
saab99t wrote:
Bit miffed by this, the anchorage points are fixed to the front seats and the inertia reel is attached inside the middle door post, unless i am missing something, what year is your 9-5 ?


Must refer to the rears...even so there are retaining nuts (I think) spot welded to the floor pan underneath.Logic would suggest the floor pan must be rusted through around those points...thats a hefty chunk of metal obscured by the fuel tank to be judged badly corroded?



Agreed on both quotes.

I've not personally been able to have a look at the underneath in order to see if you can see the rear belt mounting points, but the only other way to see them is from the top, but they are under the seat.
An MOT tester cannot remove anything in order to inspect. That will include lifting a seat to check anything underneath.

Excessively corroded would mean that you are able to push a thumb through the infected metal. Surface rust does not mean excessively corroded..
Going to check a 9-5 manual to see if there are any pics of the underneath mounting points. Pretty sure it's all blocked by the petrol tank though.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:39 pm 
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Talking Turkey
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Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 11:52 am
Posts: 22670
Location: not in a SAAB.
Car Model: One of the first RHD 9-5s
saab99t wrote:
Bit miffed by this, the anchorage points are fixed to the front seats and the inertia reel is attached inside the middle door post, unless i am missing something, what year is your 9-5 ?


Any rust around the B Pillar Sill area will be considered part of the seatbelt anchorage which is where they will be referring to. Ive yet to own a rusty 9-5 but have seen a couple of shockers. May just be down to where they have spent their life?

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97 9-5 2.0LPT Manual with B205R
97 9-5 2.0LPT Auto
52 9-5 2.0LPT Vector Sport


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:46 pm 
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Full Pressure Turbo
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Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:42 pm
Posts: 692
Location: Devon
Car Model: 2005 9-5 2.3T Vector
9000Parts wrote:
saab99t wrote:
Bit miffed by this, the anchorage points are fixed to the front seats and the inertia reel is attached inside the middle door post, unless i am missing something, what year is your 9-5 ?


Any rust around the B Pillar Sill area will be considered part of the seatbelt anchorage which is where they will be referring to. Ive yet to own a rusty 9-5 but have seen a couple of shockers. May just be down to where they have spent their life?


My understanding of it would be;

A prescribed area is about the size of a football. If the seat belt is mounted to the seat, then it is actually the seat mounting points that would fall under any prescribed area as the belt mounting is not actually attached to the car body.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:52 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:42 pm
Posts: 692
Location: Devon
Car Model: 2005 9-5 2.3T Vector
Thought so...

Quote:
6. Deliberate modification which significantly reduces the original strength, excessive corrosion, severe distortion, a fracture or an inadequate repair of a load bearing member or its supporting structure or paneling within 30cm of a seat belt anchorage.

Note: With a seat belt attached to a seat frame this reason for rejection will apply to ALL seat mounting points.

http://www.motuk.com/mot_manual/5-1.asp

The MOT tester has interpreted the reason for failure incorrectly (if it is the front belt mounting points that have been listed)
BUT we now need to know if the excessive corrosion falls within a seat mounting point.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:58 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2017 9:14 pm
Posts: 35
Car Model: saab 9-5
Steve GPS wrote:
9000Parts wrote:
saab99t wrote:
Bit miffed by this, the anchorage points are fixed to the front seats and the inertia reel is attached inside the middle door post, unless i am missing something, what year is your 9-5 ?


My understanding of it would be;

A prescribed area is about the size of a football. If the seat belt is mounted to the seat, then it is actually the seat mounting points that would fall under any prescribed area as the belt mounting is not actually attached to the car body.


That is my thoughts, never seen seat mounting points rot on these as they go into a steel beam under the carpet (front seats) unless its the edges of front floor pans, again never seen these rot at all ever.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:29 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2011 5:18 pm
Posts: 788
Car Model: saab 95
Where abouts are you


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 9:00 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:09 am
Posts: 11
Car Model: VW
dieselderv wrote:
Where abouts are you


Am south of Cambridge in Saffron Walden


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:16 am 
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Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2014 5:41 pm
Posts: 883
Location: Kippen STIRLING
Car Model: 9-5 Aero Sportwagen and more
mintno1,

I've had this as a fail with a 9-5. As Steve GPS suggests, It will be the seat mounting points that are referred to. The problem will be with corrosion around the drain points fitted to allow the anti corrosion fluid to run out quickly when the body shell is dipped during production. The edges of the holes, plugged with plastic bungs, start to rust.

My MOT tester told me that, since it was within 30 cm of the seat mounting points it was a fail, however, he also said that it didn't have to be welded, just the rusting stopped and generally made tidy. I scraped off the underseal, pulled out the plugs, ground back the rust, treated with Kurust then glassfibre patches inside and out. Two coats of underseal and he passed it on re-test. Fully aware of what I had done.

The other fail points are minor. It'll be the rearmost subframe bushes that have gone. You just need to slack off all 6 bolts to drop the subframe about 6 cm. Take the rear bolts out. This allows you to pull out the offending bush. I used the tool I have for replacing rear rose bushes on the outer end of the banana arms. Squeezing the replacement poly ones in is a bit of a faf but they do go in. Just believe.

Paul @ Kippen


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:09 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:09 am
Posts: 11
Car Model: VW
Paul Anderson Kippen wrote:
mintno1,

I've had this as a fail with a 9-5. As Steve GPS suggests, It will be the seat mounting points that are referred to. The problem will be with corrosion around the drain points fitted to allow the anti corrosion fluid to run out quickly when the body shell is dipped during production. The edges of the holes, plugged with plastic bungs, start to rust.

My MOT tester told me that, since it was within 30 cm of the seat mounting points it was a fail, however, he also said that it didn't have to be welded, just the rusting stopped and generally made tidy. I scraped off the underseal, pulled out the plugs, ground back the rust, treated with Kurust then glassfibre patches inside and out. Two coats of underseal and he passed it on re-test. Fully aware of what I had done.

The other fail points are minor. It'll be the rearmost subframe bushes that have gone. You just need to slack off all 6 bolts to drop the subframe about 6 cm. Take the rear bolts out. This allows you to pull out the offending bush. I used the tool I have for replacing rear rose bushes on the outer end of the banana arms. Squeezing the replacement poly ones in is a bit of a faf but they do go in. Just believe.

Paul @ Kippen


Doesn't sound too bad just not sure I have the inclination to fix it, if I was going to keep it I probably would fix, but was planning on selling with full MOT so might still do that just without MOT, need to figure it out over this weekend


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